To nominate someone, leave a reply as a comment at the bottom of this post. Include the name of the person and the position nominated for (President or Secretary). You may also leave a note in the PTC mailbox with the same information or return the form that will be sent home in your child’s Friday Folder.

Click here for more information about the PTC and Board Officers: PTC Information

Independent Projects
Presentations will begin on February 21, and project presentation night will be Tuesday, February 28.

Homework Club Donations
Mrs. Seville and the Homework Club “regulars” would like to ask parents for donations of snacks if possible. Healthy choices could include: Goldfish, pretzels, Cheez-its, Fruit Snacks, Ginger Snaps, Graham Crackers, Granola Bars, or bags of chips. Thanks so much for your help!

Spring Trip to Denver
Our trip to Denver is scheduled for Wednesday, May 2, through Friday, May 4. Let Jim know if you’ve been left off (or been included incorrectly on) the list: Doug Tunison, Cindy Allen, Wendy Willoughby, Jamie George, Lisa Wood, Gene Collins, Yvette Parkhurst, John Hultman, Garth Shanklin, and Sarah Finn. Denise Snider will be joining Ms. Shafer and Mr. Gaither as well. We like to have about one chaperone for every four kids, so we’re looking good right now, but if you are still interested we would love to have you join us. If you are not able to join us, just let us know.

We ask students to contribute $60 in cash each on the day of the trip, and parent chaperones to contribute $150 each in cash on the day of the trip. We realize that this may present a difficulty for some families, so please contact Jim if this is so. We have had some opportunities in the past for students to earn some cash ahead of time. The cost for parent chaperones covers the cost of the hotel stay, which is our greatest expense. Students will stay 3-4 to a room, and parents will be doubled up. (If you would like your own room, you are welcome to make arrangements with the hotel. Just let Jim know and he’ll get you the information.) Students should plan on saving a bit more pocket cash for souvenirs and possibly a lunch or two. More information to come.

We are seeing progress in work completion, but we still need to work at achieving our 80% every day for assignments turned in. Thank you for helping us keep on track by making sure your child has a complete planner and has time set aside for homework only each night.

NO SCHOOL UNTIL TUESDAY
There will be no school for students until Tuesday, February 21. The faculty will be at Woods on Thursday and Friday for professional development days.

Connected Math Conference
Ms. Shafer, Mr. Gaither, Mrs. Shell, and Mrs. Seville will all be traveling together to East Lansing, Michigan, a week from Thursday and Friday for the Connected Math Users Conference.

Conferences: Thank you so much for attending parent/student/teacher conferences this week. I hope you found them useful. I know Scott and I did. Your kids were great.

Projects: We have had some wonderful project presentations this week. Thank you for being there for your child throughout this whole process. Your reward comes on Tuesday, February 28, which is middle school project night. Please mark your calendars. Proceedings will start at 6:30 p.m. It is an academic expectation for your child to attend.

Homework Club Snacks: Mrs. Seville and the Homework Club “regulars” would like to ask parents for donations of snacks if possible. Healthy choices could include: Goldfish, pretzels, Cheez-its, Fruit Snacks, Ginger Snaps, Graham Crackers, Granola Bars, or bags of chips. Thanks so much for your help!! Mrs. Seville and company.

Teton Science School: Our trip to the Tetons is imminent. Please remember that your child will need a lunch for the bus ride there. They may bring snacks, but only pack enough for that day. Any remaining food will be collected upon our arrival at the Teton Science School. They continually strive to keep mice and other rodents out of the dorms and buildings, so they have a strict no-food policy. Similarly, any electronics other than cameras will be collected from the students and stored away for the time we are there. Please remember also to send a clean sheet and pillowcase, sleeping bag, toiletries, sunglasses, layers of warm clothes, boots, gloves, hats, etc. Please refer to the TSS clothing and supply list. On the other side of this newsletter is an itinerary for our four days at TSS. If you have any questions, you may call my cell at 262-5998.

Thanks for your support and have a great weekend.

John & Scott

Calendar of Events

• Feb. 16-17 Professional development days; no school
• Feb 20 Presidents’ Day: no school
• Feb. 21-24 Teton Science School: 7:30 am load, 7:45 am depart
• Feb. 28 Project Presentation Night: All middle school students (6th-8th) will present.

Our pod parent for the last trimester of the year is Melissa Noah. She can be reached at 265-0859.

Valentine’s Day is quickly approaching! This year, students will pick a name of someone in our classroom and make one Valentine card for that person. We will have a sign up sheet, posted during conferences, for parents to sign up for party items.

Jump Rope for Heart forms went home in last week’s Friday Folders. Forms are due Feb. 21.

Intermediate
Students turned in notes last week for their independent projects. We look forward to amazing Medieval Projects this spring. We have modeled the next steps students will undertake—taking the bits of information from the notes they have written, turning them into sentences, and putting the sentences together into paragraphs. We have worked diligently to learn how to construct solid sentences, how sentences should be of differing lengths, and about having sentences that are of a reasonable length.

We will have a combined Valentine’s Day/ Birthday Bash celebration Feb. 14 from 2:15 – 3 p.m. We will celebrate our February birthdays with treats, play Valentine’s Bingo, and open our Valentines.

In Mr. Foy’s math group students are reading, writing, and sequencing numbers to 1,000, estimating the sums of 2- and 3-digit numbers using knowledge of place value and known combinations, and playing a game called Close to 100 where they looked for pairs of numbers that add up to 100. Mr. Sallade’s math students began a familiarization with calculators, and a beginning understanding of order or operations.

Upper Intermediate
One of our student teachers, Mr. Vierkant, led an “I Am” poetry lesson as an extension of our class novel, Letters From Rifka. The poems focus on each student’s uniqueness and special interests. Poems will be posted on our website.

Students began a science unit exploring the properties of electricity and magnetism. We will send home suggested activities families can participate in at home to reinforce the learning we are doing in the classroom.

Students asked to have a trial to present their “Pizza Case” and vote democratically on the issue of whether students should be allowed to sit wherever they would like during Friday’s Pizza Lunch/Read-aloud time. Several students asked to prepare a summation and present it to a ‘jury of their peers.’ The two strongest cases were presented to the class. The jury deliberated and voted to have students stay in their own spots. It was amazing to see our students take this so seriously, and to vote on what would be best for all students.

Middle School 6th
An interesting development has mushroomed into a call for action by your children. During our cacao investigations, students learned that Cote d’Ivoire (Ivory Coast) is, the world’s number one producer of cacao. They also found out that the cacao farms there sometimes use child slave labor to reap the harvest. Last Tuesday, CNN Student News ran a segment on exactly this story. They visited a cacao farm in Cote d’Ivoire and interviewed some of the children. One of the ten-year-old boys they interviewed had been there for three years. He had never tasted chocolate and didn’t even know what cocoa was for. Another had been turned over by his mom after his father died. Students brainstormed ways to help, and now several have formed a committee. The committee will meet during recesses to write letters to chocolate companies inquiring about their efforts to ensure their cacao does not come from a farm using child slaves. We’ll have to wait and see where this effort takes them. Regardless of the outcome, I think the students will see that in this country, even an eleven-year-old kid can stand up, voice his or her opinion, be heard, and make a difference. After all, part of our mission states that we will establish a foundation for lifelong learning in an environment of democratic participation. I am proud of the students for feeling so strongly about this issue that they are willing to give up recesses to work on it.

Mr. Gaither’s student teacher, Kelsey Russell, began teaching 30 minutes of French to students on Tuesdays. We are grateful for this opportunity for students to have this exposure before taking French as a regular class next year.

Middle School 7th/8th
Students should be putting their presentation together. This consists of a spoken presentation with a visual element created to go alongside. Project presentation night is Feb. 28.

Our Spring Trip to Denver is scheduled for May 2 – 4, pending final plans and approval. Taking a whole class of 7th and 8th graders to Denver for three days and two nights requires a great deal of responsibility on our part and the part of the students. This trip is an earned privilege, not an automatic event. We have had to make the trip subject to various conditions. As a class, we have been dealing with a lack of compliance and respect for many of the adult supervisors here at school this year. We are looking at implementing some behavior contracts with certain students, and those who do not meet minimum behavior or work expectations will stay behind (allowing those who have earned the trip to go). These students will stay at Woods and do three days of schoolwork. Our class has an excellent reputation built over the last 14 years with the hotel, museums, and other sites we visit. We do not wish to have that change.

As for work ethic, the class in general has been struggling with on time completion of assignments, with frequent percentages such as 30% over the past month. We have set a goal of 80% on-time completion of assignments. Last week, we only met this goal on one day. As our school is designed for students who are, or who are willing to become, “highly motivated” and “independent learners,” we believe that this is a significant problem that we must deal with. We appreciate any support you can give us to meet this important goal.

Woods Has A Heart Day
The Woods school community will participate in a day of giving on Wednesday, Feb. 15. Circle groups will go out into the community to learn about organizations that provide assistance to those in need, deliver items and cash collected, and do some work to assist these organizations.

Items Needed by Tuesday, Feb. 14: non-perishable food items, pet food and pet supplies, toothbrushes, toothpaste, shampoo, conditioner, soap, etc. (travel sizes are best). Students also brought home “Hearts of Hope” for the Central Wyoming Rescue Mission. These hearts have slots that students may fill with quarters from their own piggy banks, or collected from family or friends. These will be delivered to the CWRM on Wednesday.

Drivers Needed: Many drivers are needed to get students to their destinations. If you can drive Wednesday between 8:15 and 11:15 a.m., please let Nicole Roden know as soon as possible at Nicole_Roden@natronaschools.org

6th Grade Teton Science School Trip
On Feb. 21, the 6th grade class will make its fifth annual trip to the Teton Science School near Jackson, Wyoming. The unique location of the very special school offers opportunities for our students to learn science from exceptional teachers in a remarkable environmental classroom. While there, students will investigate the levels of life within the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem and will learn to tell the difference among ungulate, canine, feline, rabbit and rodent tracks in the snow. They will visit the National Elk Refuge and learn of its purpose, its successes, and its drawbacks.

Students will learn to cross country ski and will snowshoe into the foothills of the Tetons to discover the geology of the area and the forces at work that carved the glacial valleys, left the moraines, and filled the deep glacial lakes with water.

Students will also develop new methods of communication with their classmates, build their relationships, and raise their awareness of their own impact on the environment while trying to limit it. They will prepare their own lunches, do their own dishes, and live without television or electronic games for most of four days. And they will love it.

Tie Dye Help Needed
WLC art teacher Chris Dvarishkis is looking for parents who have tie dying experience interested in volunteering to help students with this activity. Please contact her at Woods by calling 253-3900 or email her at Chris_Dvarishkis@natronaschools.org

Changes to February Lunch Menu
The following change has been made to the lunch menu:

• Feb. 15—Joe Cheesiers (instead of nachos)

Homework Club Snacks Needed
Mrs. Seville and the homework club “regulars” would appreciate donations of snacks for before- and after-school Homework Club. These should be healthy and in small packages such as crackers, raisins, pretzels, Goldfish, fruit snacks, etc. Thanks!

Thank You

• Thank you to the Hultman family for the donation of books to the library/Recycle Your Read.
• Thank you to Kellie Vlastos for shelving books in the library

Recycle Your Read—Donations Needed
Do you have books your child has read and loved that now are collecting dust? Recycle them by donating them to the WLC library for the 3rd annual Recycle Your Read that will be held near Earth Day 2012.

Please send your donations of gently used children’s books, appropriate for K – 8th grade students, to the WLC library.

Students will be invited to select books from those donated.

Woods Learning Center Mission
Our mission is to guide children to become inquisitive, responsive, and creative citizens of our community and world by establishing a foundation for lifelong learning in an environment of democratic participation.

Volunteer Opportunities
In an effort to provide parents opportunities to fulfill their parent volunteer hours and become involved in the school and community service projects organized by WLC, the newsletter publishes opportunities for them to volunteer their time. Opportunities both inside and outside school will enable inclusion of parents with a variety of schedules.

• Lunchroom/Playground Volunteers Parents are invited to eat lunch with their children and accompany them to the playground for recess.
• Crossing Guards Volunteers are needed to serve as crossing guards after school from 3:15 – 3:35. Contact Pam Hopkins.

Pack Ink Cartridges for Recycling WLC recycles ink cartridges for cash. Pack and prepare boxes for mailing. This needs to be taken care of every month or two. Contact Mary O’Connor.

Drive for Have a Heart Day Many drivers are needed to get students to their destinations on Wednesday, Feb. 15. If you can drive Wednesday between 8:15 and 11:15 a.m., please let Nicole Roden know as soon as possible at Nicole_Roden@natronaschools.org

Coming Events
Game Club Monday and Wednesday afternoons in the Intermediate classroom. A variety of board, math and card games are available. Those who attend may bring games from home to play. Meeting dates are Feb. 13, 15, 22, 27 and 29. All are welcome.

• District Scheduled Professional Development Days Feb. 16 & 17. School will not be in session.
• Presidents’ Day Monday, Feb. 20. School will not be in session.
• Teton Science School 6th Grade Trip Tuesday, Feb. 21 – Friday, Feb. 24.
• Middle School Project Presentation Night Tuesday, Feb. 28.
• Band & Orchestra Concert Thursday, March 1 at 1:15 and 6:30 p.m. Students in grades 7 & 8 will perform.
• Spring Break March 5 – 9. School will not be in session.
• PAWS Window March 5 – March 23.

Homework Club Before- and after-school for students in grades 4–8. Morning sessions—Tuesday through Friday from 7:30 – 8 a.m. Afternoon sessions—Monday through Thursday from 3:15 – 3:45 p.m. Snacks are provided.

Snack Cart Fundraiser Students in the UI pod will sell snacks after school to raise money for the class trip to Washington D.C. and NYC in May. Snacks will be sold from 3:15 – 3:30 p.m. at the south end of the building Monday – Thursday afternoon. Snacks sell for $1 or less.

Box Tops for Education WLC is collecting Box Tops for Education labels that are redeemable for cash. Labels are on selected General Mills products. Please save these labels and send them in to the WLC office.

Cash For Trash Fundraiser WLC collects empty laser and inkjet printer cartridges from students, parents, or businesses and trades them for cash. If you have cartridges from your home, place of employment, or another source, please send them in to the WLC office.

Aluminum Cans Recycling WLC collects aluminum cans as a fundraiser. If you would like to donate your cans to the school, please bag them and deposit them next to the receptacle north of the building in the parking lot. Students will place the cans in the receptacle.

Safeway/Albertsons Gift Cards Safeway and Albertsons gift cards are available at the WLC office in a variety of denominations. They can be used like cash to make purchases at Safeway and Albertson stores. This program is a fundraiser for the Woods PTC. Please contact Mary O’Connor for more information.

Information Please
Look for the Woods Learning Center News weekly in your child’s Friday folder. If you have information to include, please leave it in Judy Neal’s box in the staff mailroom by 3:15 Thursdays, email her at judy_neal@natronaschools.org, or call her at 253-3900.

Independent Projects
Presentations will begin on February 21, and project presentation night will be Tuesday, February 28.

Homework Club Donations
Mrs. Seville and the Homework Club “regulars” would like to ask parents for donations of snacks if possible. Healthy choices could include: Goldfish, pretzels, Cheez-its, Fruit Snacks, Ginger Snaps, Graham Crackers, Granola Bars, or bags of chips. Thanks so much for your help!

Spring Trip to Denver
Our trip to Denver is scheduled for Wednesday, May 2, through Friday, May 4, pending final plans and approval. If you have questions, please let Jim know. Thanks to those who have already expressed interest! Let Jim know if you’ve been left off (or been included incorrectly on) the list: Doug Tunison, Cindy Allen, Wendy Willoughby, Jamie George, Lisa Wood, Gene Collins, Yvette Parkhurst, and John Hultman. Denise Snider will be joining Ms. Shafer and Mr. Gaither as well. We like to have about one chaperone for every four kids, so we’re looking good right now, but if you are still interested we would love to have you join us.

Update on Behavior, Work Ethic, and the Spring Trip…
Thanks to all the parents who have talked to us about this issue. We have seen some significant improvement in work completion. We have a plan, and we would love to have your thoughts. We are going to implement a contract for each student. The goal is that students will turn in 80% of their assignments on time, and will meet a certain behavior expectation each week. We will look at these contracts weekly. If 80% or more of our students fulfill this contract, then the whole class will be able to go to Denver. (If we were to hold more than five students back, it would require additional staff.) We are certain that our students will rise to this challenge, encourage their peers, and earn this trip. More information to come!

Have a Heart Day
Wednesday, February 15, is Have a Heart Day, when Woods students go out to do community service with their circle groups. If you can drive, please let Mary O’Connor know.

Les Miserables
Our class has been invited to attend part of the dress rehearsal for the Kelly Walsh production of Les Miserables on Wednesday afternoon, Februrary 15, from 2:00 to 3:00. We will make every effort to be back to school at dismissal time.

Teton Science School: Local geologist, David Law, presented to the class on Thursday of this week. He gave a brief overview of the geologic processes that created the Tetons and provided the students with a great handout showing and explaining the folding and faulting processes that took place over many millions of years. I gave each of your children another copy of the Teton Science School clothing and supply list. Please look it over and try to put together all of the needed items so your child is ready to go first thing Tuesday morning (7:30a.m.), Feb. 21.

Conferences: Thank you so much for attending parent/student/teacher conferences this week. I hope you found them useful. I know Scott and I did. Your kids were great.

Homework Club Snacks: Mrs. Seville and the Homework Club “regulars” would like to ask parents for donations of snacks if possible. Healthy choices could include: Goldfish, pretzels, Cheez-its, Fruit Snacks, Ginger Snaps, Graham Crackers, Granola Bars, or bags of chips. Thanks so much for your help!! Mrs. Seville and company

Thanks for your support and have a great weekend.

John & Scott

Calendar of Events

• Feb. 13 Complete project with visual and oral due; class presentations this week
• Feb. 14 TSS Chaperone Meeting, 4:30 – Happy Valentines Day!
• Feb. 15 Woods’ Have a Heart Day – We will spend the morning giving back to our community.
• Feb. 16-17 Professional development days; no school
• Feb 20 Presidents’ Day: No school
• Feb. 21-24 Teton Science School
• Feb. 28 Project Presentation Night: All middle school students (6th-8th) will present.

Les Miserables
This is just a reminder that we will be attending the play Les Miserables at KW on Wednesday the 15th, at 2:00pm. We will be leaving the school at 1:15 to walk over as a class. If your child does not have a permission slip in by then, they will not be going with the class. It truly is a wonderful opportunity, so we hope everyone will be able to join us. If you need another copy of the permission slip, please let Karen or Marci know so we can get you one. Please make sure they are dressed in their semi-best. =) One of our goals in viewing this performance is to remind the students (and practice) how they should behave appropriately at an event of this nature. You can help at home by discussing this with your child as well.

Reminder
There is no school for kiddos next Thursday and Friday (the 16th and 17th), because the staff has professional development scheduled. Also, there is no school on Monday the 20th due to president’s day. Enjoy the break! =)

Have a Heart Day
As in past years, Woods will be having their annual community service day. We are excited to be giving back to those who may need it more than ourselves. You child should have brought home information on this event on Wednesday. If you did not receive it, please check the school website.

Homework Club Request
Mrs. Seville and the Homework Club “regulars” would like to ask parents for donations of snacks if possible. Healthy choices could include: Goldfish, pretzels, Cheez-its, Fruit Snacks, Ginger Snaps, Graham Crackers, Granola Bars, or bags of chips. Thanks so much for your help!! Mrs. Seville and company.

Thank You
We would like to take a moment to let you all know that we appreciate your attendance at your child’s conference. It’s great for the kids to know we are a team, dedicated to helping them succeed and grow. We couldn’t do it without you!

In addition, we know that we are all life-long learners. So in an effort to continue to make adjustments and improvements as teachers, we are requesting your feedback. The following is a form we like to call “Two Thoughts & a Wish.” It gives you the chance to give us some feedback about how you think things are going (the good, the bad, or the ugly), and what you might wish to see. We would appreciate any response and are grateful that you might take the time to reply.

For the last three sessions of our class trebuchet project, we have worked on rewriting one paragraph. We are working with purpose, and to model the work that goes into making simple sentences from our bits of information, and combining the simple sentences into a paragraph. We spent just over 15 minutes trying to rewrite one sentence, and still were unable to get where we wanted to be. We talked about rather than to just sit frustrated and not make any progress, it’s ok to skip that sentence and come back to it with a fresh mind and relaxed spirit.

Included in today’s Friday folder is an editing hand to remind students of their editing points when working on their projects.

The Intermediate pod has been invited by the Primary pod to a wedding of vowels on Valentine’s Day. They sent us invitations that we RSVP’d to telling them we would be delighted to attend. We thought it would be fun to stay with the theme of Valentine’s Day and dress in pinks, reds, whites. Please do not see this is in any way as required and feel the need to go buy cloths. What is worn daily is fine.

Reminder: We will have a combined Valentine’s Day/Birthday Bash celebration on Tuesday, February 14th, from 2:15-3:00. During this time we will celebrate our February birthdays with some selected treats and some fun activities. Then we will open our Valentines to end the day. If you need a list of student names from our classroom to address Valentines, it is available on the website, and was in last week’s intermediate newsletter.

Book orders are due back to us by Friday, February 17th. Please make all checks payable to Scholastic Books. If you wish to order books online, please use the activation code J7PT9.

In Mr. Foy’s math group this week, students were tested on their understanding of numbers up to 1,000. They also learned to play another math game called Capture to 300 in which they add and subtract ones, tens, and hundreds to and from 2- and 3-digit numbers.

Mr. Sallade’s math group is continuing its work on number trains, friendly numbers, neighbors, and quick 10s. We have also worked on the math activity, Closest to 20. Students work to get as close as possible to 20, finding different combinations using three of five cards they have available.

Spotlight Student: Emma

Upcoming Events

• Valentine’s Day/Birthday Bash Feb. 14
• WLC Have a Heart Day Feb. 15
• Professional Development Days Feb. 16 & 17—No School
• President’s Day Feb. 20 No School

Project Dates

• February 21 Rough Draft Due
• March 1 Paper Due
• March 19 Class Presentations
• March 22 Project night

Wednesday we read Miss Piggle Wiggle Won’t Take a Bath. We discussed good hygiene.

Friday, Mrs. Begquist led us in Yoga. We talked about stretching, breathing and relaxation. We gave them strategies for relaxing if they feel anxious.

Next week we take a closer look at heart health.

Thank you to all the parents who came to parent-teacher-student conferences. We appreciate your time and we enjoyed sharing your child’s growth with you.

We have two field trips coming up where we need parents to drive. Next Wednesday, February 15th we need many parents to transport most of the students in our school. If you can drive in the morning on this day please email Nicole Roden at the email listed below.

Just our class needs drivers on Friday the 24th for a trip to Dr. Prugh’s Dentist office. We will leave at 9:15 a.m. and be back around 10:15 a.m. If you can help get us there please let us know. Thanks!

We decided not to do treats for Valentine’s Day because we will be eating cupcakes for the AU, AW Wedding. If you would like to send a small individually wrapped treat for students to take home, that would be fine. Thanks!!

Next week is a short three-day week and then students have a five day break. NO FRIDAY FOLDERS or homework next week. Spelling for the following week was sent in today’s folder.

Star Student Feb 21-24: Maggie

Upcoming Events

• Monday, Feb. 13th: Trip to Public Library *Books Due
• Tuesday, February 14th: AU and AW wedding 12:45 Afternoon Valentines
• Wednesday, Feb. 15th: WOODS HAS A HEART DAY -All morning -We Need Drivers
• Thursday, Feb. 16th – Friday Feb. 17th: No School Teacher Professional Development Days
• Monday, Feb. 20th: No School – President’s Day
• Tuesday, Feb. 21st: Jumprope for Heart Forms Due
• Friday Trip to Dr. Prugh’s *We Need Drivers Leave 9:15 a.m.

In the past, we have taken a school bus to Denver, in order to catch our flight. Every time, it has required us to stay the night in a hotel prior to catching our plane in the morning. The last time we went, it also meant staying the night in Denver after returning. There are regulations that stipulate that bus drivers are not allowed to be on the road after 2AM. Therefore we were not able to drive back after landing. In an effort to save money, and because many adults don’t enjoy riding on the bus, we thought we would seek your input. We have the option to offer to have adults travel down to Denver with their children on their own. We would all meet at the airport before our flight. Adults could car pool, if they wanted to also. We would be responsible for the children traveling alone, and would drive them to Denver in a District suburban or van. Otherwise, we could all travel on the bus as we have in other years, and stay in one or 2 more hotels. This is going to have to be an, ‘all or nothing’ deal. If you would all prefer to drive on your own we will go that route, but if not, we will be looking at a bus, and an extra fee for hotels for adults. Below, please let us know what your thoughts are in regard to this issue.

Sincerely,

Marci & Karen

Please please leave your reply as a comment below.